this post was submitted on 10 Sep 2023
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We have the ättestupa in Sweden - the idea that we pushed the elderly off a cliff when they got old.
Since most of us can't afford retirement this should make a comeback.
Or we push billionaires down a cliff and use that money to take care of the elderly.
You didn't need that 5th house or that sailing yacht anyway.
Funny how this archetype has existed forever across many cultures
There's a funny scene about this in Norsemen
There's a less funny scene about this in Midsommar
Stop! Hammer time!
Wasn't that the only way to get to Valhalla except dying in a fight?
And IIRC you had to jump yourself (sure gramps jumped all by himself!!!).
Nah this was a deliberately comedic scene in Gautreks Saga where members of a family keep sacrificing themselves for absurd reasons. There is some possibility that something like this could have happened in some parts of Norse society but there’s no evidence it was a requirement for entry into Valhalla (Old Norse Valhǫll).
In fact, whereas the Prose Edda (a 13th-century narrative guide to understanding skaldic poetry) does claim that those who fall in battle end up in Valhǫll, and this is supported by evidence from pre-Christian poems such as Grímnismál, Norse mythological sources are actually littered with attestations of people dying in combat but not going to Valhǫll, as well as people dying outside of combat but still ending up in Valhǫll.
One example of this is the character Sinfjǫtli from Vǫlsunga Saga. Sinfjǫtli is poisoned by his mother-in-law at a party, and his father Sigmundr carries his dead body down to the shore where a ferryman offers to take it across the water. Once the body is on the boat, it turns out the ferryman is Odin and he disappears with the body which is elsewhere confirmed to have ended up in Valhǫll in the poem Eiríksmál.
Scholar Jens Peter Schjødt theorized in Pre-Christian Religions of the North that entry into Valhǫll is predicated on a person being dedicated to Odin, which is something a person could do for themselves ritualistically (there are references to marking oneself with a spear for Odin) or could also be done to you by an enemy who has set out to kill you and intends to “give” you to Odin as a way of showing his own dedication.
It also seems logical that Odin wants the best warriors fighting for him at Ragnarok and would take precedence over dying in battle or not.
There's an argument to be made that warriors who die in battle are less skilled than fighters who survive to a ripe old age. Cohen the Barbarian springs to mind, and probably onto your horse/lady/treasure when you're not looking... on his way to return fire to the gods.
Right, although this idea is somewhat challenged by the story of Sigurðr who is by all accounts the best, bravest, and most famous of all Norse heroes with exploits that include slaying a dragon and receiving personal assistance from Odin on multiple occasions. Sigurðr Is stabbed by his brother-in-law and is able to actually cut the guy in half before dying himself but is then attested as going to Hel in various ways but never to Valhǫll.
It’s unclear why this is and I haven’t seen much discussion about it in scholarly discourse. There is, of course, lots of discussion about what Hel really is/means. But it may have been something implicit in the story that the ancient Norse would have inferred as being obvious. For example, maybe he lost favor with Odin by rescuing the Valkyrie Sigrdrífa from the sleep curse that Odin had placed upon her.
This sort of an idea shows up in Sonatorrek, ostensibly written by Egill Skalagrimsson. In that poem, Egill is lamenting the loss of his son who drowned in a boating accident. In that context, Egill talks about this tragedy in terms of Odin having broken off friendship with him. As a result, Egill has decided to cease sacrificing to Odin, and the consequence is that he now has a vision of Hel standing on the headland waiting for him.
"Nah, I don't think I'm going to do it."
Ah I've seen this in Midsommar, thought it was completely made up. Still a shit movie
Not a fan of horror movies then?
Not especially. If we're talking horror as in scary, then yea, but it has to be more than gratuitous jumpscares. If we're talking psychological, graphic horror, which I feel is what Midsommar was trying to be, then not too much. I felt it really lacked a purpose and existed only to serve shocking visuals. I found the director's previous film (The Witch, I think?) to be way more compelling.
It's perfectly possible to be a fan of a genre, but not of a particular film in that genre. Stop trying to make it weird.
It was an odd addition to their comment, obviously meant to incite a reaction. I bit