this post was submitted on 30 Nov 2023
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Data Hoarder

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We are digital librarians. Among us are represented the various reasons to keep data -- legal requirements, competitive requirements, uncertainty of permanence of cloud services, distaste for transmitting your data externally (e.g. government or corporate espionage), cultural and familial archivists, internet collapse preppers, and people who do it themselves so they're sure it's done right. Everyone has their reasons for curating the data they have decided to keep (either forever or For A Damn Long Time (tm) ). Along the way we have sought out like-minded individuals to exchange strategies, war stories, and cautionary tales of failures.

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So I run a video production company. We have 300TB of archived projects (and growing daily).

Many years ago, our old solution for archiving was simply to dump old projects off onto an external drive, duplicate that, and have one drive at the office, one offsite elsewhere. This was ok, but not ideal. Relatively expensive per TB, and just a shit ton of physical drives.

A few years ago, we had an unlimited Google Drive and 1000/1000 fibre internet. So we moved to a system where we would drop a project onto an external drive, keep that offsite, and have a duplicate of it uploaded to Google Drive. This worked ok until we reached a hidden file number limit on Google Drive. Then they removed the unlimited sizing of Google Drive accounts completely. So that was a dead end.

So then we moved that system to Dropbox a couple of years ago, as they were offering an unlimited account. This was the perfect situation. Dropbox was feature rich, fast, integrated beautifully into finder/explorer and just a great solution all round. It meant it was easy to give clients access to old data directly if they needed, etc. Anyway, as you all know, that gravy train has come to an end recently, and we now have 12 months grace with out storage on there before we have to have this sorted back to another sytem.

Our options seem to be:

  • Go back to our old system of duplicated external drives, with one living offsite. We'd need ~$7500AUD worth of new drives to duplicate what we currently have.
  • Buy a couple of LTO-9 tape drives (2 offices in different cities) and keep one copy on an external drive and one copy on a tape archive. This would be ~$20000AUD of hardware upfront + media costs of ~$2000AUD (assuming we'd get maybe 30TB per tape on the 18TB raw LTO 9 tapes). So more expensive upfront but would maybe pay off eventually?
  • Build a linustechtips style beast of a NAS. Raw drive cost would be similar to the external drives, but would have the advantage of being accessible remotely. Would then need to spend $5000-10000AUD on the actual hardware on top of the drives. Also have the problem of ever growing storage needs. This solution we could potentially not duplicate the data to external drives though and live with RAID as only form of redundancy...
  • Another clour storage service? Anything fast and decent enough that comes at a reasonable cost?

Any advice here would be appreciated!

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

From what it sounds you want a NAS and Tape Archive.

So get a device which holds your working Projects, you mentioned arount 20-40TB which is no problem nowdays. Can be done for under 1k with of the shelf stuff.

And Tape backup for stuff you dont need regularly. Maybe chose an older generation of LTO I would look for something that can hold about 1 Project per Tape or the likes of it. LTO5 is pretty cheap used, ca be had for 500 Bucks but is only 1.5TB per tape.

Disclaimer, with LTO never look at the compressed NR, its for compressable data only which video is not. Thus with LTO9 you will only get 18TB

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Yeah we've got a solid situation for our live projects. Each of us work off 40TB thunderbolt raids with local external drives as our backup and live online backup to Dropbox.

This is for our archived work, but yeah of that, we access around 20-40TB fairly regualrly. Good to know that tape won't compress video data at all!

NAS is sounding more and more like our best bet.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

For what it is worth in the NAS:
20x 6TB HDD - $1,400 ($11.66 per TB)
10 x18TB HDD - $3,500 ($19.44 per TB)

Hopefully deals like these can keep the cost of your NAS down a bit

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Not to be rude or anything, but External RAIDs individual to the user is not really a solid soulution. It may work for 1-2 People working on one project at a time. But it just does not scale. What if someone needs to acces files of that project? they move the raid or plug their laptop on a differen workspace? Not really a great soulution IMO.

Like you say in the last part having a NAS with maybe a bit of room to grow sso 100TB might be the best option that way everyone can access the data and work accross projects. And more importantly it would offer work from a different place in the office or even work from home.

Yea with tape the compressed nr are very missleading. Thats a best case scenario where the files compress 2:1 with TAR+gzip which it literallly never does. Bestcase I have seen was 1.2:1 on a folder consisting of config files. Basically nothing nowdays is compressable you will interact with, except textfiles depending on format. So its best to always asume the raw space as the space you get

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

Haha we’ve been this way for 12 years. Certainly not ideal if we scale. But we won’t ever. 4 of us ever needing access. And transferring over the network is not an issue. NAS is too slow for most real time editing. 10gbe is fine but still fairly slow. Those raids will soon be upgraded to SSD raids for each editor. Thanks tho…

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

This.^

2 small NASs + 2 LTOs (LTO5 may be sufficient for your individual projects, but you also need to backup the NAS, so at least LTO 7 or 8)