this post was submitted on 14 Jun 2024
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I was thinking about using graphene OS, but I've read some lemmy users dislike this OS due to perceived misleading advertising and the pixel 7a you're supposed to install graphene on because it's from google (an advertising company).

Another option would be lineage OS, but there is so much false information about this OS, namely compatible phones that simply don't work with this OS and no support.

what works for you? I want a phone with no google, that doesn't force me to use the manufacturer's ecosystem and that won't show the apps I don't want or need (on an asus I own you cannot neither get rid nor hide bloatware)

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[–] [email protected] 64 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (6 children)

GrapheneOS is probably the best option out there.

As you said, it's only for Pixels currently, because

  1. They are more secure than most other phones. They have some kind of chip built in that makes them superior. I don't know the specifics, but other commentators might add some information if needed. Something with encryption if I remember correctly. The GrapheneOS team is a bit ...picky... when it comes to security, and most other phones don't reach their requirements for a secure device.
  2. Google is one major contributor to Android, and their phones are fine tuned to work perfectly with it. Other manufacturers' phones feel less polished.
  3. It's easier to maintain one line of devices that are very similar, instead of keeping hundred phones up to date and secure. Pixels are similar to iPhones, they get updated almost simultaneously and are similar. If you now add a phone from a different line, e.g. a Fairphone or Nothing Phone, things get more complicated. If you look at Calyx (more onto that later), the FP4 caused quite some headaches for the dev team.

Pixels are cheap(ish) for what you get, and I believe Google makes them so cheap because 99% of users don't care which ROM/OS is installed. Those are the advertisment-cows that will get milked. If you buy a Pixel and install a custom ROM on it, they will loose money.


My experience with GrapheneOS has been great. My Pixel 5 hit EOL a while ago and still gets maintenance updates almost weekly.
Many security additions are overkill for me, but quite some make a lot of sense.

I used CalyxOS for a year too, but now that I don't get full updates anymore, I don't feel safe anymore with it.

I think GrapheneOS is technically superior to Calyx, especially due to the sandboxing they do. MicroG has full root privileges and can do with your phone what it wants, while also breaking some apps due to missing dependencies. If you choose to enable Play Services on GrapheneOS, they are user level and heavily restricted, and only you decide how much access you want to give them.

Regarding Calyx, since they don't limit themselves as much in terms of security, they also offer a ROM for the Fairphone. Maybe check that out too.

DivestOS also seems to be a good option. AFAIK it's based on LineageOS and supports a lot of devices, while being more secure than LOS.

Regarding Linux phones, I don't have any experience with them. I tried Phosh (Mobile Gnome) on an exhibition a while ago, and it felt great and interesting, but from what I've heard, they are nowhere as good as Android.


My personal ranking:

  1. GrapheneOS on a Pixel. Get an used/ refurbished device if you don't want to support Google. Best price-performance ratio, great OS, and very good hardware (battery life, camera, etc.)
  2. CalyxOS on a Fairphobe. Modular device with good repairability. Nowhere near as good in terms of what you'll get for your money. Better security than 95% of other phone ROMs, oh, and you can just swap your battery in seconds if you want that :D
  3. DivestOS on a random supported phone, e.g. a China device. Nowhere near as sustainable (short lived update support, no spare parts, etc.)
  4. Linux phone. Only a good option for a tinkering device right now imo.
[–] [email protected] 15 points 4 months ago

Great synopsis!

The cool thing about GrapheneOS: It provides basically all the comforts and usability as any Android (stock) ROM minus some compatibility issues with a portion of Google Apps and services (Google Pay doesn't and probably will never work, for example) while providing state-of-the-art security and privacy if you choose to utilize those features. A modern Pixel with up-to-date GrapheneOS, configured the right way, is literally the most secure and private smartphone you can get today.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago (4 children)

Same here, I have an old Pixel 4a that still gets security updates from GrapheneOS. Banking apps and Amazon don't seem to like it, but I don't mind just doing those on my laptop anyway.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Banking apps and Amazon don't seem to like it

Try going into the app's settings and toggle Exploit protection compatibility mode. That let me use my banking apps that didn't work before.

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

I use LineageOS because my phone is not a Pixel and it works fine for me. If you don't want to pay Google for a Pixel, buy a used one. Other than that LOS is fine. It doesn't have anonymization features like /e/OS or something like that but it doesn't force nor promote any apps or ecosystems (except for Seedvault but it's not a big deal) and it is FOSS

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I have a Pixel and LineageOS is the best by far. Freedom to root, which I absolutely want... I want full control over my devices. I'm extremely picky about how every little thing runs and works in my phone and I can only get it with root. You can't get root with GraphenOS without a huge pain in the ass with updates.

It's hilarious people install GrapheneOS and think they are better off because Google services are installed as user apps instead of system. You lose as soon as you install them either way. They are getting the data they are after no matter if it's installed as a user app or system app.

But anyway, I've been running LineagOS since it used to be Cynogenmod over 10 years ago. It's the most established and reliable while remaining open to customization by far.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (7 children)

Unfortunately 90% of privacy-conscious people can't live without Google services because Google Meet, banking apps and other Play Integrity needing stuff

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago (1 children)

That's literally what MicroG is for, though. Spoof the Play store and GSF, no data in or out. I think a good part of that "90%" you mention knows about that solution?

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (23 children)

I'm using /e/ os for more than 3 years on different devices (with some customizations) and it works like a charm. An important aspect is that you can install e on any phone that has the bootloader unlock and supports GSIs - theoreticaly any device that runs Android > 9

/e/ has a gsi image which is neat!

I don't use nor promote any banking apps or other G**gle/proprietary dependendent apps.

Why nobody talks more about e.foundation /e/ OS?

Enlighten me please 🙂

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago

+1 for /e/OS! Brilliant combo of user friendliness with open source and privacy

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

There isn't any Foss phone. Graphene os and everything else requires proprietary software for the modem to operate at a minimum.

If you are ok with some proprietary software go with Lineage OS.

For devices that support Lineage OS go here: https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 4 months ago (7 children)

GrapheneOS is perfect. Pixel phones are Google hardware yes, but works like a dream once GOS is installed. NO MORE GOOGLE !!! Frequent OS updates, love it

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

I've used Lineage on multiple devices, Calyx, and Graphene. Graphene by far has the least issues (basically none), and the best compatibility in my experiences. Being able to relock the boot loader is perfect for a mobile device too.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 4 months ago

I've read some lemmy users dislike this OS due to perceived misleading advertising and the pixel 7a you're supposed to install graphene on because it's from google

There is no misleading advertisement. Go with Graphene if you own a Pixel (from Pixel 5 up) or you can find a cheap second-hand one.

there is so much false information about this OS, namely compatible phones that simply don't work

Care to share which devices are you talking about? If a device is officially supported by the latest LineageOS version, it works.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I use Calyx on a Fairphone 4. It's not totally degooglified, since it comes with MicroG which is used to connect to Google services. I use Aurora Store and a couple of original Google Apps like Gboard too (none of my Google apps can access the internet, since they're behind the built-in firewall). It works well except call functionality which can be wonky and there's the issue that a lot of apps from Play don't work well with MicroG. I only use a small selection of Play apps though, so it doesn't bother me too much.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago (7 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago

I was about to answer this, but decided I didn't want that information in public.

However, the bank I use, which is a largish one, has an app that I've installed with the aurora store without microg or google play services on divestos and it complains that it won't work without gsf, but it works fine after clicking ok.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Calyxos user here. I like it so far. Half a year into it. I can live with microg instead of gms. And it also works on moto g32, 42 and 52 so you don't need Google hardware.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Using GrapheneOS on a pixel 8 pro bought for this. Never used the stock OS. Coming from iOS it is a breeze of fresh air to feel "private". I tried lineage some times ago but it isn't as polished as graphene, and it feels like a classic android OS, I didn't feel " private".

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 4 months ago (11 children)

Calyx. It just works. I've honestly just used it like stock Android, using as many private apps as possible. It's so fun seeing all the cool little projects not on iOS! I just recently discovered Petals, which helps with measuring THC intake.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 4 months ago

I've had calyxOS on this phone now for about 2 uears now. Its pretty good. It comes with microG to simulate the google apis.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 4 months ago

I've been using Graphene since the pixel 4a, have never considered going back. It works wonderfully.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 months ago (3 children)

Not sure why GrapheneOS is getting down voted so much here, did I miss something recent that happened?

I've been using GrapheneOS on my Pixel 6a for around 2 years and really like it.

If I couldn't use GOS though, I would probably go with DivestOS. I haven't looked deep into other alternative Android ROMs.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago

I use GrapheneOS. Can't go back!

[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago (19 children)

Used pixels are surprisingly cheap for how well they hold up over time, and graphene works well.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago

I totally agree. Used pixels are superb with grapheneos. Syncthing is what i use ad a backup. I think the problemi is that google stops releasing updates after 5 yearss old units don't get updates I think. I have the 5th June build and it reports a security update of December 2023.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 4 months ago

Can you elaborate on being misled there?

As for google devices - yes, there's irony in the notion that the most de-googleable phones are theirs, sure. They're often sold at a loss around the holiday season, though.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago

Ι use Murena's e/OS, I like the iphone-likeness of it. It works.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (3 children)

PostmarketOS, pinephone, using phosh (sxmo is good too, but no support for dvorak keyboard :( :( :( ). Very jank, but I would never go back to Google/Android (or derivatives) after tasting what could be. Might try to switch to Void Linux or base Alpine since PostmarketOS is shipping systemd by default next release ("optionally, with openrc still being supported", but we all know openrc is being pushed to the side, especially since it needs recompilation to switch back). Hope to boot OpenBSD on it some day.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago

No OS is perfect, as you likely do have to use a proprietary modem and some proprietary apps, but CalyxOS works well for me on my Fairphone 4. I like the base install being as free as realistically possible on a modern Android phone, especially replacing Google apps with microG. Just don't enable SafetyNet if you don't want it to run (sandboxed) Google blobs. That API is deprecated anyways.

The experience is smooth, free and I get a repairable phone without having generative """AI""" shoved down my throat. A win on all fronts in my opinion.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago (5 children)

Not in my ideal spot but tolerating Android via LineageOS for microG on a Sony Xperia 5 III as their ROMs make microG painless & hardware-wise I get a fast-enough CPU, OLED, a headphone jack, & microSD.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago

I personally prefer Lineage OS

[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (1 children)

just so everyone is aware grapheneos only support's pixels because it is specifically designed for taking advantage of the hardware security features found in google's tensor and titan chips. and thus installing it on another phone would kinda miss the point (and vastly increase the scope of the project)

google is also basically the best company when it comes to phones for custom roms, as they provide stock images, a simple bootloader unlocking process (that doesn't void your warranty as far as i can tell), and generally the aosp and software support that comes from being the phone of the developer of android.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (2 children)

@merompetehla
Such question I like to answer with this link from a security specislist.
privsec.dev/posts/

Please check the category Android.
Graphene seems the best possible custom rom.
I use Lineageos because I got an old phone for free.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (3 children)

I am on a pixel 7 with graphene OS. Been great. Ive been using this phone for about a year or so now.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago (2 children)

I run LineageOS for microG, on LOS for more than 5 years now. I am not willing to pay for Pixel phones, even the used devices are to expensive for me. I do not really care about an unlocked bootloader, so that's alright.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago (1 children)

GrapheneOS on a Pixel 8 Pro. I've been super happy with it since I switched from iOS.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

I like grapheneos, very close to stock android without google shit

  • you got bonus settings like the sensors toggle

Lineage is kinda bad privacy and security wise, from the little I know its not fully degoogled

[–] theroff 8 points 4 months ago (6 children)

Lineage is kinda bad privacy and security wise, from the little I know its not fully degoogled

My understanding is kinda the opposite:

  • GrapheneOS ships with a sandboxed, FOSS Google Play Services which can optionally do a bunch of Google things (use their APIs, login to Google etc.) plus they have some hosted services that can substitute Google services (like geolocation).
  • LineageOS basically doesn't ship with any Google Play style API/frameworks at all. It's a pure AOSP experience. Any apps on F-Droid work but third party apps (like ones found on Google Play) are hit and miss. If you can just use F-Droid for all of your apps then LineageOS is probably a much more private and secure offering.
  • LineageOS for microG is an unofficial fork of LineageOS which includes a FOSS Google Play Services compatibility layer, a bit like GrapheneOS. As far as I know it doesn't have the same level of sandboxing as Sandboxed Google Play on GrapheneOS.

Both GrapheneOS and LineageOS publish monthly updates with upstream security patches for all supported devices.

Both GrapheneOS use network-provided DNS by default.

Apparently both GrapheneOS and LineageOS connect to connectivitytest.gstatic.com via http as a Captive Portal test by default,althoughh this was as of 2019-2020 and both might have changed since then.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago (1 children)

CrDroid... Use it mostly because it's stock android with a few extra options...

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago
[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago (4 children)

I'm fairly happy with LineageOS myself

but there is so much false information about this OS, namely compatible phones that simply don’t work with this OS and no support.

I think you're overreacting a bit calling it "false information". LOS is a FLOSS project that many individuals have ported to their device — and either at some point they buy a new phone and drop that development, or they realise what a massive project it is to maintain it. That's just a general bummer with open source, especially when people volunteer their free time.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (3 children)

GrapheneOS is nearly the worst custom ROM you could use to achieve privacy, and Google Pixels the worst phones you could use to get away from Google.

GrapheneOS officially supports and encourages the use of Google Play Services and a Google account for “security” purposes. Their “unofficial” members also spread propaganda advocating for the same.

https://i.imgur.com/bUdVCpH.jpg

They are also an embargo partner with Google for security patches, and add features that may threaten the lives of privacy users, or end up in jail or death in certain circumstances.

https://web.archive.org/web/20220829223401/https://twitter.com/GrapheneOS/status/1564322206414524420#m

https://old.reddit.com/r/privacytoolsIO/comments/pjl4bh/what_is_your_opinion_of_grapheneos_conforming_to/

There are a lot of GrapheneOS astroturfers in this thread. They are not organic fans.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago

Went with lineage since I grew up on cyanogenmod.

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