this post was submitted on 15 Oct 2024
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Interrogation (lemmy.world)
submitted 3 weeks ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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[–] [email protected] 55 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)

Being literally-ignorant of morality would be a justifiable defense. according to the story, they had no knowledge of good and evil, and therefore could not knowingly sin. They'd be declared mentally incompetent to stand trial and, given that it was just a fucking apple (or probably not, actually...); the prosecutor chided for wasting the courts time.

but then, it's a bronze age myth and they really didn't give a fuck about niceties like 'presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law', or due process in general.

[–] [email protected] 38 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I wrote an essay about that once. Adam and Eve were meant to chill in the garden for literally all of eternity but were still created as curious, fallible beings with no knowledge of evil. Ergo it was logically impossible that they wouldn't have eaten the fruit eventually, whether that was in 3 days or 3 million years.

[–] [email protected] 46 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

It doesn’t take an omniscient being who can see the entirety of the past, present and future to know that.

Which, means they were decidedly not meant to chill in the garden. Rather, they were meant to eat the fruit and gaslight into believing it was their fault.

It’s like some idiotic-asshole who gets a pair of golden retrievers, tells them they can have all the kibble and dog treats they want, but not the pizza left on the counter.

Of course Adam and Steve are gonna snarf on the pizza the moment Jackass leaves. It’s not their fault. They’re just dogs.

(What? This is my story. The dogs are Adam and Steve.)

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Exactly. In keeping with my other comments, that's why some early christian sects actually viewed Eve as a hero in the story, because she freed them from ignorance... You know, back when christianity was driven by women and wasn't just roman ideology wearing a Jesus skin mask.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

Can you suggest any reading (like long form articles or something) about the women-led xtianity traditions?

I’ve never heard anything about that, and I’d like to know more.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

You can find these collections in the Apocrypha. It’s a collection of all the weird side-stories that could have become biblical cannon but were scrapped for various reasons.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 weeks ago

Cool thanks! I’ll take a look!

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

I wish i had something off the top of my head but I'm mostly basing this off what i remember from uni lectures.

That being said if you look up early Christianity you'll see that women filled the roles of priests and were often responsible for spreading and maintaining the faith before its roman adoption. You can even even see this in the bible where the earliest chronological chapters are extremely sympathetic to women, then become less and less so as time goes on.

I'll see if i can find a specific reference for you later today.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 weeks ago

that motherfucker paul turned the christ cult all incelly

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 weeks ago

No worries, I appreciate it anyway :)

I wasn’t raised with any sort of religion, so I don’t know much about any of it (and definitely haven’t read the Bible.. tho I tried once and was bored out of my skull), but I feel like if I’d learned about that I’d remember it :p

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 weeks ago

Affluenza

[–] [email protected] -1 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

idk man. they were in heaven and god was like "look you can have everything you desire, just stay away from this one single tree. ok? this is my tree. you will get literally everything you wish for, at your fingertips, immediately, except this one fucking tree. can you do that?"

and they went "nah lol"

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 weeks ago

and they went "nah lol"

Any one who’s raised kids knows that the moment they created that one restriction, it set up a fascination with that tree. Curiosity is like that. The more they remind themselves they can’t, the more they wonder.

All the other stuff? Boring. Old news.

More over, they were literally the definition of ignorant. They had no understanding of good,evil, or sin; only that they were told not to.

Like toddlers. Except instead of teaching toddlers to behave, he kicked them out of the home, disowns them and says “good luck, fuck off, and oh if you come back a giant flaming sword will go up your ass.”

[–] [email protected] 52 points 3 weeks ago

Adam: “I literally do not know the difference between right and wrong. Neither does she.”

God: “Sucks to be you.” banned

[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

"I'm sorry Angel, but I will not be speaking without the advice of my lawyer."

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 weeks ago

God: "Lucy, old buddy? I need you to invent something for me"

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 weeks ago

"But there are only 2 people! And you know lawyers could never be angels"

[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

Only kinda related but one of the reasons the early christian gnostics gave for questioning the identity of the old testament god is this exact thing. God is supposed to be omniscient but for some reason is confused about what happened with the apple and doesn't know where Adam is hiding... Interesting to think about.... Maybe. Idk.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Growing up, I just assumed that it was like how when my parent's dachshund realized she was about to get a bath and would hide under the bed. Sure. they knew where she was the entire time; but they wanted her to come out on their own.

having never quite fully grown up and still DMing for D&D... I can assure you he was just play acting for the plot; so he could bring his DMPC in to save the day. (suffice it to say, god would be a shitty dm, if god existed.)

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I think thats a pretty solid interpretation. The gnostics have other points too though, like the vast difference in personality between the vengeful old testament god (which they claim is a separate entity) and the loving new testament god.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 weeks ago

Are you implying they retconned their own god? Blasphemy /s

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Which is why there was a counter-culture belief that Jesus was preaching about a higher god than the one in the Torah. The one in the Torah was thought to be basically a spaz who couldn't do creation correctly and the god of Jesus was more powerful and intelligent. All those texts were destroyed when the Roman church got power.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Just in case you didn't know, there was a big cache of gnostic texts found in Nag Hammadi but the discovery got overshadowed by the dead sea scrolls. They were very cool to look into and shed a lot of light on pre-romanized Christianity.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Yes, I read The Gnostic Gospels by Elaine Pagel last year. It wasn't as good as The Origin of Satan, also Pagel (and how I found her). I just finished an excellent book on the historicity of Jesus that had a lot of info on the Gnostics.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 weeks ago

I'll check those out! I find the subject super interesting.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 weeks ago

Didn't recognize him without the leaf.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 weeks ago

Good luck getting a trial infront a jury of peers eh pears